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Olio : Rak nastaje bez obzira da li se radi preventiva ...

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Nepročitano 04-02-12, 20:23   #71
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Olio :
Rak nastaje bez obzira da li se radi preventiva ili ne, a nikada se ne može utvrditi da li je preventiva bila uzrok sprečavanja pojave raka, jer se ne zna kada se rak mogao pojaviti, a da je sprečen. Ovo je kompleksna tema, i ne možeš tako olako razbacivati reči.

Inače ne volim citirati ničije riječi, jer svi znamo da su riječi mali dijelić onoga što mislimo, i da ne moraju nužno oslikavati stanje navedenih misli.
Olio, ne znam koji dio ti nije jasan što se tiče nekih stvari, po tebi je rak puka posljedica mnogih još neistraženih varijabli (čak i pokraj današnje toliko dične znanosti i znanstvenika, koji misle da će razumijevanje dobiti cijepanjem atoma, a upravo je bitno gledati veću sliku), koje su suviše kompleksne da bi ih jedan običan čovjek razumio , s čime se ne mogu složiti, a kako neću ništa "argumentirati" jeli, jer će sve to zvučati neutemeljeno i puko šeranje linkova, neka ovo ostane jedna najobičnija opaska.
A onaj tko zna, dovoljno je danas informacija , i predovoljno da o nekim temama osnujemo adekvatno mišljenje, koje će nam pomoći konkretno u životu, i našim bližnjima, a ne koje će nam ostaviti uliven dojam da imamo tobožnje bolje razumijevanje od ljudi koji se drže jednostavnog življenja, jer naravno , svaka tema koji se želi iole objasniti, zahtijeva mnogo laprdanja i mentalne onanije, raznih drugih i trećih perspektiva, 6 kašika skepticizma i sl...
I naravno nije isto, odojak i radić.
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Nepročitano 04-02-12, 20:36   #72
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Hi!

Citat:
Originally Posted by Olio Pogledaj Post
Uz veliko poštovanje prema ozbiljnosti teme, želim da vam kažem jednu stvar. Pre svega, ne treba govoriti o tome Kako sprečiti rak, jer dok nema obolenja, ne može se ni sprečiti ono čega nema, i verovatno nikada neće ni biti, ako se sprečavaju potencijalno uzroci koji su nam poznati. Ono što nam nije poznato, ne možemo sprečiti. Potrebno je misliti tako da se sprečavaju svi "potencijalni Uzroci" koji mogu dovesti do raka, a ne sprečavati bolest koje nema.
Da rezimiram, kako sprečiti Uzroke moguće bolesti raka, a ne kako sprečiti rak.
Kada se bolest pojavi, onda je potebno raditi na tome kako sprečiti napredak bolesti, i kako je eliminisat, a to su sasvim različiti pristupi i reakcije. Mala igra reči, ali je ponekada rezultat deprimirajući i uznemiravajući po pojedince, to znam iz iskustva mnogih ljudi.
Sve najbolje.

U potpunosti se slažem, treba se baviti uzrocima i spriječiti.

Je li tko zna kako se je zvao doktor medicine, Nobelovac koji je u dvadesetim godinama prošlog stoljeća dobio Nobelovu nagradu za svoje istraživanje da u blago bazičnom pH organizma se rak niti ne može razviti? Jedan makrobiotičar, sportaš mi je o njemu pričao, no zaboravila sam njegovo ime. Tada još valjda nije postojao tako jaki lobby farmaceutske industrije kao danas (imali su samo aspirin i dobro), pa je zato prava osoba dobila Nobela.

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Nepročitano 04-02-12, 21:03   #73
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Angry

Citat:
Originally Posted by Linda1968 Pogledaj Post
U potpunosti se slažem, treba se baviti uzrocima i spriječiti.

Je li tko zna kako se je zvao doktor medicine, Nobelovac koji je u dvadesetim godinama prošlog stoljeća dobio Nobelovu nagradu za svoje istraživanje da u blago bazičnom pH organizma se rak niti ne može razviti? Jedan makrobiotičar, sportaš mi je o njemu pričao, no zaboravila sam njegovo ime. Tada još valjda nije postojao tako jaki lobby farmaceutske industrije kao danas (imali su samo aspirin i dobro), pa je zato prava osoba dobila Nobela.
Naravno da znam Linda, to je Johannes Andreas Grib Fibiger.

Ovo je dokaz koliko je kancer neumoljiv.

(Reuters) - A scientist who won the Nobel prize for medicine Monday used his own discoveries to treat himself for cancer, but died of the disease just days before he could be told of the award.


Ovo je dobitnik nobelove nagrade za 2011... eto koliko je sve relativno.

Sativa, ne znam šta tebi sada nije jasno?

Znaš i jedan uzrok kancera, a da nije UV zračenje ili neki od oblika gama, beta ili X zračenja?
JA samo naglašavam da je uzročnik kancera nedovoljno poznat, a ako je uzrok nedovoljno poznat, tada je i prevencija nedovoljno egzaktna.
Kod loma kostiju sve je jasno, nikada se ne može polomiti kost ako se ne izvrši dovoljno snažan pritisak. aAli se kancer dobija u najrazličitijim stanjima i fazama života, dobijaju ga i deca koja nisu ni imala vremena da se izlažu štetnim uticajima, a znamo da mnogi žive u najgorem nepoštovanju svojeg organizma, i umiru od starosti ili neke bolesti, ali ne uvek i od kancera.
Ne naziva se kancer uzalud "podmukla bolest", jer napada kada se najmanje očekuje.

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Nepročitano 04-02-12, 21:14   #74
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[quote=Olio;209991]Naravno da znam Linda, to je Johannes Andreas Grib Fibiger.

Ovo je dokaz koliko je kancer neumoljiv.

(Reuters) - A scientist who won the Nobel prize for medicine Monday used his own discoveries to treat himself for cancer, but died of the disease just days before he could be told of the award.


Ovo je dobitnik nobelove nagrade za 2011... eto koliko je sve relativno.


Je li imaš neki materijal o njemu? o Johannesu Andreasu Grib Fibigeru odn, o njegovom radu, neki sažetak?

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Nepročitano 04-02-12, 21:24   #75
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Johannes Andreas Grib Fibiger (April 23, 1867 Silkeborg – January 30, 1928 Copenhagen) was a Danish scientist, physician, and professor of pathological anatomy who won the 1926 Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine. Fibiger had claimed to find an organism he called Spiroptera carcinoma that caused cancer in mice and rats. He received a Nobel prize for this discovery. Later, it was shown that this specific organism was not the primary cause of the tumors. Moreover, Katsusaburo Yamagiwa, only two years later in 1915 successfully induced squamous cell carcinoma by painting crude coal tar on the inner surface of rabbits' ears. Yamagiwa's work has become the primary basis for this line of research.[1] Because of this, some consider Fibiger's Nobel Prize to be undeserved particularly because Yamagiwa did not receive the prize.[2] But others[who?] credit Fibiger with showing that external stimuli can induce cancer and proving the correlation by experimental method. Encyclopćdia Britannica's guide to Nobel Prizes in cancer research mentions Yamagiwa's work as a milestone without mentioning Fibiger.


While studying tuberculosis in lab rats, Fibiger found tumors in some of his rats. He discovered that these tumors were associated with parasitic nematode worms that had been living in some cockroaches that the rats had eaten. He thought that these organisms may have been the cause of the cancer. In fact, the rats had been suffering from a vitamin A deficiency and this was the main cause of the tumors. The parasites had merely caused the tissue irritation that drove the damaged cells into cancer; any tissue irritation could have induced the tumors.

Although the specific link between the parasites and cancer was later known to be relatively unimportant, it was discovered later that tissue damage was a cause of cancer. This was an important advance in cancer research. Other parasites (such as Schistosoma haematobium and Clonorchis sinensis) are now known to cause cancer in humans.
One of his experiments from 1898 is by some regarded as the first controlled clinical trial.

Verovatno imam još, ali se može naći i još ponešto na netu.

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Nepročitano 06-02-12, 07:55   #76
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Zadani

Zasto bi se zdrave osobe bavile bolescu ?
Da je farmacija , industrija hrane, sporta... u toj populaciji
otkrila dio kolaca vec je poznato ; a i alternativa ima specijaliste za zdrave ljude.

" ne zelim bolest..." , bavimo li se ovom afirmacijom intenzivno..., hm?
nije li tako da misao tezi da se materijalizira i da stvarno "ne zelim bolest" ...ali je tada vec imam/o.


...umnozi l`se blago ,
nek vam srce za nj ne prione . Ps, 62,11



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Nepročitano 22-03-12, 13:44   #77
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Citat:
Originally Posted by Olio Pogledaj Post
Znaš i jedan uzrok kancera, a da nije UV zračenje ili neki od oblika gama, beta ili X zračenja?
JA samo naglašavam da je uzročnik kancera nedovoljno poznat, a ako je uzrok nedovoljno poznat, tada je i prevencija nedovoljno egzaktna.
.
mislim da je uzrocnik jako dobro poznat a, leži u hrani koju jedemo....više nema jabuke koja nije deset puta špricana, mesa koje nije tretirano raznim preparatima....malo toga prirodnog nam je ponuđeno, svi samo gledaju kako da ostvare što veci profit a, karcinom je ocito cijena koju placamo....iskreno, bojim se da nam više nema spasa, postali smo zarobljenici farmaceutske industrije jer smo radi pohlepe za novcem zatrovali svako zdravo sjeme, košticu, mladicu, životinju....i , sad jedino pitanje koje si možemo postaviti je zapravo koliko godina ce trebati i dal cemo uopce ikada uspjeti sve vratiti na staro...
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Nepročitano 22-03-12, 21:27   #78
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Da uzročnik je u gotovo svim slučajevima dobro poznat, a to je neočekivani stresni događaj tzv. konflikt šok u velikoj većini, ostatak otpada na prije navedena različita trovanja.
Jačina i trajanje šoka ovisi koliko će biti duga faza izlječenja tj. veliko tumorno tkivo.

Kada se pacijent suoči sa liječničkom 'dijagnozom' zada nastupaju novi konflikti sa novim posljedicama.
Moja preporuka je uvijek zadržati svoj mir bez obzira što tko kaže ...

Ovo su osnove osnova, a više o tome ima na temi GNM - germanska nova medicina na ovome forumu te nešto i na početku ove teme, a čitanjem bioloških zakona na 'bolesti' se gleda sasvim drugim očima.
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