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Vitamin B12

Ovo je diskusija na temu Vitamin B12 u podforumu Vegetarijanstvo
BTW - macu sam uzimala stalno, hranila se iznadprosječno kvalitetno, 50% ...

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Vegetarijanstvo Vegetarijanskom prehranom do zdravlja

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Nepročitano 24-12-14, 14:02   #11
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BTW - macu sam uzimala stalno, hranila se iznadprosječno kvalitetno, 50% sirovo ... pa svejedno imam nizak B12.

Ne kažem da veganstvo i vegetarijanstvo nije validan izbor, ali potrebno je redovito se kontrolirati i ciljano suplementirati: B12, B9, D vitamin i Omega 3 te željezo prema potrebi ali nakon kvalitetno napravljenih pretraga.

Toliko o tome.


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Nepročitano 24-12-14, 15:12   #12
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Citat:
Originally Posted by Jesam Pogledaj Post
Sinke, uistinu ne znam čemu takav ton i način u komunikaciji svaki put kada se izlaže nešto sa čime se osobno ne slažeš.
Napisala si da maca nije hrana nego suplement (dodatak prehrani, u prijevodu).

Pa te lijepo pitam jel maca nešto što se na umjetan način proizvodi ili je to jestiva biljka?
Ne govorimo o metaboličkoj ulozi mace u našoj prehrani nego o klasifikaciji.

Citat:
Maca je adaptogen i utječe na hormonski balans organizma na način da ujednačava vrijednosti - u pojedinim situacijama je uopće nije pametno konzumirati, npr. ako je kortizol kontinuirano nizak.
da, govoriš o metaboličkoj ulozi, dakle ne protuslovim da je maca adaptogen (zapravo me to u ovom trenutku nije nimalo briga koja joj je metabolička uloga), nego te pitam jel maca nešto što se na umjetan način proizvodi ili je to jestiva biljka?

Citat:
U našem je podneblju uopće nema, prema tome, naši ljudi je NE konzumiraju pod normalno, a ako da - onda u vidu praha kao suplement prema specifičnim potrebama.
Da, a poanta je?

Citat:
Čak i da je se konzumira ko brokulu, ona nije dovoljna da zadovolji sve potrebe organizma za B12, posebno ako je prisutno neko od oboljenja tipa autoimunih od kojih dana boluje 60% populacije (bubnula sam ali mislim da sam i podcijenila brojku, samo što to mnogi ne znaju nego šutke pate i trpe jer im nitko ne zna objasniti što im je).
Ako je netko bolestan, onda je to specifično stanje.
Jel ima maca dovoljno B12 za NORMALNE ljudske potrebe? Ima, i to jedva ali ima. Ali nije ni bitno.

BITNO je sljedeće: da si iskopirala tekst sa neistinitom tvrdnjom: da B12 ne postoji u namirnicama biljnog porijekla.

Postoji!

I to nije osobno neslaganje nego činjenica. I zato takav ton i način komunikacije: jer kopiraš tekst koji sadrži netočnost.



Citat:
Pišem o stvarima koje sam dobro proučila. Zar bi ja sad tebi trebala napisati: get help!?
Ajmo 'uzet malo mace' i adaptirati način komunikacije.

Ja pišem sve ovo iz najbolje namjere da pomognem onima koji ne znaju i griješe jednako kao što sam ja griješila dugo dugo - jer sam isto napola provjerila neke stvari.
Jel ovo biljka ili nije?



Ili je to suplement
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Nepročitano 24-12-14, 15:14   #13
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Originally Posted by Jesam Pogledaj Post
BTW - macu sam uzimala stalno, hranila se iznadprosječno kvalitetno, 50% sirovo ... pa svejedno imam nizak B12.

Ne kažem da veganstvo i vegetarijanstvo nije validan izbor, ali potrebno je redovito se kontrolirati i ciljano suplementirati: B12, B9, D vitamin i Omega 3 te željezo prema potrebi ali nakon kvalitetno napravljenih pretraga.

Toliko o tome.
Trebala si uzimati tablete B12. Nitko nije ni rekao da se treba oslanjati na macu. Toliko o tome.
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Nepročitano 24-12-14, 16:11   #14
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Citat:
Originally Posted by sinkezg Pogledaj Post
Trebala si uzimati tablete B12. Nitko nije ni rekao da se treba oslanjati na macu. Toliko o tome.
Jednostavno ne mogu prešutjet ovo... Već sam ti na drugoj temi rekla da si sve sa svojim predlaganjem tableta rekao...

Ne govori li ti to da tu nešto smrdi? Kakva je to ishrana u koju moraš tablete (pa bio to i nekakav "vitamin") uguravat, inače se očekuje da ćeš oboliti, kad-tad?!


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Nepročitano 24-12-14, 20:52   #15
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Citat:
Originally Posted by sinkezg Pogledaj Post
Napisala si da maca nije hrana nego suplement (dodatak prehrani, u prijevodu).

Pa te lijepo pitam jel maca nešto što se na umjetan način proizvodi ili je to jestiva biljka?
Ne govorimo o metaboličkoj ulozi mace u našoj prehrani nego o klasifikaciji.
Nisam napisala da nije hrana, čitaj bolje. Napisala sam da se uzima kao suplement - a suplement se može raditi od biljaka, povrća, voća, mesa itd. Ne razumijem što uporno želiš dokazati.
To da te nije briga da li je adaptogen je tvoj problem. To je činjenica koju nikako ne bi trebalo previdjeti.

Citat:
Originally Posted by sinkezg Pogledaj Post
Ako je netko bolestan, onda je to specifično stanje.
Jel ima maca dovoljno B12 za NORMALNE ljudske potrebe? Ima, i to jedva ali ima. Ali nije ni bitno.
NEMA! I nisam bila bolesna oduvijek. Nema je dovoljno ni za zdrave ljude, osim ako dnevno pojedu kamion mace, što bi imalo druge posljedice. I da - vrlo je bitno, kad si već krenuo piliti po tome.

Citat:
Originally Posted by sinkezg Pogledaj Post
BITNO je sljedeće: da si iskopirala tekst sa neistinitom tvrdnjom: da B12 ne postoji u namirnicama biljnog porijekla.
Ti imaš neku fiksaciju na nebitne detalje izgleda. Molim te reci koliko se ljudi u europi hrani macom na način da je svakodnevno kuha u čušpajz ili riba na salatu? Zanemarivo i totalno nebitno za poantu koju ovdje želim ljudima predstaviti. Totalno je nebitno da li u maci ima B12 jer je činjenica da je puno ljudi u deficitu s B12 i da ga je potrebno suplementirati.

Citat:
Originally Posted by sinkezg Pogledaj Post
I to nije osobno neslaganje nego činjenica. I zato takav ton i način komunikacije: jer kopiraš tekst koji sadrži netočnost.
Nedostatak B12 može uzrokovati agresivno ponašanje. Kako vidiš, ovdje se svi razgovaraju civilizirano, bez vrijeđanja - i to bez obzira da li se slažemo u mišljenju, da li je nešto 'netočno' ili nije. Postoji uvijek lijep i manje lijep način da se na nešto ukaže. Zašto ti odabireš posprdan i grub, to znaš samo ti.

Citat:
Originally Posted by sinkezg Pogledaj Post
Jel ovo biljka ili nije?
Citat:
Originally Posted by sinkezg Pogledaj Post
Ili je to suplement
Biljka koja se sušena i mljevena koristi kao suplement.


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Nepročitano 24-12-14, 20:54   #16
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Citat:
Originally Posted by Nanette Pogledaj Post
Ne govori li ti to da tu nešto smrdi? Kakva je to ishrana u koju moraš tablete (pa bio to i nekakav "vitamin") uguravat, inače se očekuje da ćeš oboliti, kad-tad?!
Vitamin B12 dobija se iz bakterije koja se pre ere prskanja i pranja voca i povrca, u vise nego dovoljnoj kolicini dobijala iz biljaka. Zivotinje koje ljudi jedu, same jedu prljavu hranu, i tako dolaze do B12. Tako da se ne moze tvrditi da se preko prirodnog veganskog nacina ishrane ne moze dobiti taj vitamin. Tablete, sprejevi i injekcije B12 se koriste samo zbog zaprasivanja i temeljnog pranja voca i povrca, sto je posledica moderne civilizacije koja ga eliminise iz biljaka.
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Nepročitano 24-12-14, 20:56   #17
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Citat:
Originally Posted by sinkezg Pogledaj Post
Trebala si uzimati tablete B12. Nitko nije ni rekao da se treba oslanjati na macu. Toliko o tome.
A o čemu ja ovdje pišem???


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Nepročitano 24-12-14, 20:58   #18
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Citat:
Originally Posted by frust Pogledaj Post
Vitamin B12 dobija se iz bakterije koja se pre ere prskanja i pranja voca i povrca, u vise nego dovoljnoj kolicini dobijala iz biljaka. Zivotinje koje ljudi jedu, same jedu prljavu hranu, i tako dolaze do B12. Tako da se ne moze tvrditi da se preko prirodnog veganskog nacina ishrane ne moze dobiti taj vitamin. Tablete, sprejevi i injekcije B12 se koriste samo zbog zaprasivanja i temeljnog pranja voca i povrca, sto je posledica moderne civilizacije koja ga eliminise iz biljaka.
Zanimljivo. Imaš li neki izvor za više podataka o ovome?

(Sinke - ovako se lijepo komunicira )


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Nepročitano 24-12-14, 21:05   #19
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Citat:
Originally Posted by Jesam Pogledaj Post
Zanimljivo. Imaš li neki izvor za više podataka o ovome?

(Sinke - ovako se lijepo komunicira )
http://www.indianvegan.com/faq.php
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Nepročitano 24-12-14, 21:10   #20
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OK - dakle kaže ovako:

All vitamin B12 is produced by bacteria and all animals in their natural environment get enough B12. Most species consume B12 in their diet, but ruminants such as cattle and sheep have extra stomachs which allow bacteria to produce B12 internally provided the animals are consuming enough cobalt. Our great ape relatives consume up to 5% animal products with even the gorilla consuming up to 1% as insect contamination of their natural diet of leaves and fruit.

Iz čega slijedi da ga nema u biljkama nego ga proizvode bakterije, a to ipak nije isto.
I koji god bio razlog - vraćamo se na činjenicu da ga danas ne možemo dobiti iz biljaka, nego samo iz mesa, što znači da ga treba suplementirati, što je i poanta na koju sam htjela ukazati.


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